Tempers flare as councilors discuss fire staffing
Staff photo/Kathy McCarty
STAFFING ISSUES at the Presque Isle Fire Department were discussed at Monday night’s City Council meeting. Pictured during a PowerPoint presentation are, from left: Councilors Jessica Chase-Smith and Dick Engels; City Manager Jim Bennett; Deputy City Manager Martin Puckett; and Fire Chief Darrell White.
By Kathy McCarty
PRESQUE ISLE — Talk of staffing at the Presque Isle Fire Department took up the majority of Monday night’s four-and-a-half-hour City Council meeting, with the discussion becoming heated at times as city officials and councilors debated changes to the department that would see full-time staffing go from four per shift to three — a staffing change first discussed last fall when councilors voted on a resolve to have this year’s councilors consider a staff reduction come this fall’s budget talks.
At May’s meeting, councilors requested City Manager Jim Bennett work with Fire Chief Darrell White and Deputy City Manager Martin Puckett to create a report explaining how such a change would impact the department and services it provides. The three men spent nearly two weeks compiling information, coming up with about 100 pages of data and a PowerPoint presentation which was shared with the Council on Monday. Bennett said while full-time members provide many services, including airport coverage, school safety programs and fire and life safety inspections for businesses, as well as EMA training, all of that was “set aside” when putting the report together.
Puckett and White took turns explaining what the projected impact of reducing fire platoon size from a four- to a three-person crew would be for the community. Videos were shown depicting three fire scenarios and how within three to five minutes a structure can be fully involved and that response time is a critical factor in determining whether the fire can be contained.
Bennett emphasized that, for report purposes, it was assumed, regardless of staffing, that firefighters would presume a victim was inside and therefore would enter the building. OSHA’s two-in, two-out rule dictates that when there are less than four firefighters on scene, they cannot enter a structure unless a life is at risk. Bennett noted that all four firefighters have to be interior-qualified as well — not just any firefighter can enter a building.
Insurance ratings (ISO) and training of full-time and volunteer firefighters were also discussed at length. Puckett used several examples from departments across the country and how staffing levels affected workers’ comp and health insurance costs. In one case, it was noted a department had increased from three members to four, following a report citing an increase in injuries with the smaller staffing level. “The three-person crew had a 55.6 percent higher loss of time due to job-related injuries than did four-person crews,” said Puckett.
“A Colorado Springs study also indicated a three-person crew was 2.6 minutes slower than a four-person crew when responding, resulting in an increase in damage of 53 to 80 percent,” Puckett said.
White indicated that without a fourth person, a crew cannot enter a building unless a life is in danger. He said in order to win the battle with fire, it’s imperative firefighters be able to enter a building.
“Spraying water through a window from outside just spreads the fire around. You need to be able to get inside to knock it down and save the structure,” said White.
Even before the presentation was over, some councilors expressed displeasure with the report, saying it “wasn’t what was asked for.”
“This is a very emotional issue — can paint a picture any way you want. If firefighters get on board, they can do it. If we tell Darrell we’re going from four to three, we want to see what you’ll do. All we have is scare tactics on what might happen,” said Councilor Bruce Sargent. “Why not build a report on what we can do.”
“There’s nothing in the report about working with full-time guys. I don’t think it’s objective. That was a huge part of the resolution,” said Council Chair Emily Smith.
The city manager said he was “given the challenge of showing the impact of going from four to three” and that the report “wasn’t to say what we’ll do to go from four to three.” Bennett noted that the life safety code was “out the window when we put the report together. We’re going in regardless. We would have kept it in if we wanted to use scare tactics.”
Councilor Jessica Chase-Smith said the end of the report indicated what the department would do and that the “PowerPoint is not scare tactics but actual facts.” She expressed support of keeping the four-member level.
Councilor Dick Engels feared the Council was being “penny wise and pound foolish.”
“The potential damage far outweighs savings. The pictures demonstrate how fast a fire moves. Paying a volunteer and on-call — that’s extra cost there. There appears a likelihood of injury when staff is reduced,” said Engels. This would leave you “having two fire trucks and three members with their thumbs you-know-where, waiting for a fourth. I’m not in favor of going with (the reduction).”
Engels questioned the wisdom of cutting firefighters to save a few dollars that, in turn, could result in larger losses and greater risk to public safety.
Puckett explained there would be minimal savings to citizens, based on a median home value of $80,000 and $1,880 tax bill, of just over $16 per property taxpayer the first year — due to the city having to pay unemployment for laid off firefighters — and about a $25 savings the following year.
Sargent said taxpayers would never see the money, since it would go to offset other areas of the municipal budget.
The Council chair said she’d rather see the impact on commercial rather than residential. Bennett said those figures could be obtained.
“Where do we go from here? Back in December four members of Council voted to have a plan in place to consider going from four to three. I had staff de-emotionalize (the report). We worked our butts off to find objective ways to come up with answers. I think we did a damn good job,” said Bennett. “Can we mitigate — take a look at ISO’s — sure. Some departments have made decisions to save money but have not had as good response times.”
Sargent asked for different scenarios and ideas “to keep four people on scene every fire,” and that it could be done if “you think out of the box.”
“We should have the information within a few months,” said Sargent. Bennett responded by saying there was no “magic bullet” and he didn’t think there’d be an answer in four to six weeks or even four to six months.
Councilor Randy Smith said “I want four people but don’t want to pay for them.” He said it might mean not being able to offer the “same level of service” and that people might need to carry more insurance rather than rely on firefighters to save their property.
Councilor Micah Desmond, who noted he’d worked at Northeast Packaging when the company had two fires, said “none of the things on here (the resolve) were done or looked at. All we’ve heard is what happens when we go to three, none of how to make it work.”
White said at least part of the resolve concerns had been addressed, with the department moving ahead with trying to get student volunteers to stay overnight. He noted, however, that with college out, it would be fall before it was known if there would be any interest in such a program.
Councilor Peter Hallowell indicated while a four-person shift would be ideal, it was a matter of finding ways to balance the budget during tough economic times. He said the ISO rating wasn’t a factor, since much of Presque Isle is beyond the urban compact.
Emily Smith said the resolve included “aggressively training on-call firefighters” and that she “didn’t feel this was taken into consideration.” She repeatedly questioned why full-time staff weren’t expected to respond when fires were toned out and that perhaps a stipend could be paid to guarantee volunteers show up.
Bennett told the Council chair on several occasions that requiring full-time staff to respond in such a manner would violate certain labor laws, including restricting their movements during off hours, in addition to added costs for overtime, and that the contract with the union would need to be changed. He also noted the difference in response time for full-time and volunteer/on-call varied by several minutes and that in no case, while putting the report together, did he find any information indicating a volunteer arrived on scene before full-timers.
“Even if volunteers are 100 percent trained, it doesn’t change response time,” said Bennett.
Sargent suggested using volunteers for overnight shifts, paying them a stipend for being there. White said the volunteers have other responsibilities, including jobs and families. It was also mentioned that there could be legal concerns with letting a paid firefighter go, then filling the position by paying a stipend. Sargent also suggested as new officers are hired for the police department, they could be cross-trained to serve as firefighters. “They could run the truck or something,” Sargent said.
Sargent suggested the department was “in job protection mode.” Bennett replied, stating, “If we’re in job protection mode, we wouldn’t have cut the thousands of dollars that we have” from the budget.
“If you think some crew’s doing that, that’s a reflection on me and the job I’ve done,” said Bennett.
Councilors agreed to table the discussion to a later date, to allow Bennett and his staff to gather additional information as requested.
